Make your own free website on

In no event will I be liable to any party
(i) for any direct, indirect, special, punitive or consequential damages (including, but not limited to, damages for loss of business profits, business interruption, and the like), or any other damages arising in any way out of the availability, use, reliance on, or inability to use my Comments about Bad Numismatic Dealers/Traders page and its information, even if I have been advised of the possibility of such damages, and regardless of the form of action, whether in contract, tort, or otherwise.
(ii) for any claim attributable to errors, omissions, or other inaccuracies in, or destructive properties of any 'information'.
(i)This list can change at anytime.
(ii)This list is provided as a public resource for numismatists.
(i)No party will hold me responsible/liable for any and all damages/losses to anyone who gets ripped off on any and all deals with any and all dealers listed on this web page.
(ii)No party will hold me responsible/liable for any and all damages/losses to anyone who collects coins, paper money, medals, exonumia (including, but not limited to, tokens) and other elements of numismatics for investment, as the numismatic/precious metals market can take unpredictable turns at anytime, anywhere in the planet Earth or the universe.
(i)Please don't send unsolicited, harassing, obscene or threatening e-mail or s-mail (snail mail) to anyone listed on this page.
(ii)Please don't "spam" (including, but not limited to, sending junk e-mail, unsolicited commercial e-mail, unsolicited bulk e-mail and mailbombing) anyone listed on this page.
(iii)You are responsible/liable for your own actions and you will not hold me responsible/liable for your own actions.
(i)Remember that the goal of numismatics (coin collecting) is to have fun, and not to be greedy.
(i)By reading any or all contents of this web pages (and their links), you will abide by all terms of this disclaimer.

Comments about Bad Numismatic Dealers

This page is always under construction.

NOTE: Some of these comments may be edited by me to remove any objectionable words/obscenities, or to correct spelling/grammar.

Comments about Charles Benner

I am a coin collector from Russia. I am collecting World Coins. 
Several years I have coin trade with collectors all over the world. Coin trade 
by mail give opportunity to get coins which are not available in my country. I 
enjoy not only in coin trade but also contacts with coin collectors all over the 
world. I have friends in different countries. But some coin **collectors** are 
very strange. In 1994-95 I had coin trades with Mr. Charles F. Benner. from 
Pasadena, MD, USA. About three years [ago] I sent him Russian coins from his 
wantlist and got from him nice US coins. But in 1995 I had not reply from him after 
I have sent him coins valued more then $100. Some months later I have sent him a 
letter with the question: What happened but had no reply. I thought may be he have 
problems with health or worse. But in 1996 my mate said that he had correspondence 
with Mr. Benner from Pasadena. After two coin trades my mate had no replies from him. 
I tried to write Mr. Benner again but had no reply. Now I think that it is some sort 
of business for Mr. Benner.  May be it is misunderstanding but I have reasons to think 
that it is not misunderstanding. May be Mr. Benner is ON-LINE and I would like to hear 
what he thinks about it. Or may be somebody know Mr. Benner from Pasadena?

Comments about Chattanooga Coin Company

I will tell you what was the problem with Chattanooga Coin [Company].  It will curl 
your hair!  They claimed that they sold me a different variety of [a] late date large 
cent.  Some jerk defaced the word CENT and changed one of the letters.  I never want to 
deal with that problem again.  I must admit that they took the coin back, and sent me a 
better one than I paid for, but this experience left a bad taste in my mouth.

On the television, as I write this, is a show on a shop at home channel.  They are 
selling coins at supposedly "bargain" prices.  I feel bad for those who buy into this 
sham.  The two gentlemen are throwing the coins around like frisbees, causing damage to 
the coins, handling them like children and talk about overpriced.  It's incredible!!!  
To those of you who are new to the hobby, beware, please go to a dealer near you or ask 
around before venturing into the land of the television sales people.

What you are watching is a clown from shop at home helping the "big cheese" from 
Chattanooga Coin Company sell their goods.  If you've followed this newsgroup, Chatt.  
Coin Co.  has a rather "poor" reputation for "questionable" business practices.  
Obviously, no matter what they say "On the Air" they're out for the $.  Doesn't help 
this hobby in the eyes of newbie's just getting started [into coin collecting].

At all costs, AVOID Chattanooga Coin Company, as they're nothing but trouble!

Unbelievably high or low prices?  I have seen their program TV here in Michigan 
and I thought the prices were a ripoff.  A knowledgeable collector would not be fooled but 
the infomercials are aimed at beginners and those who know nothing about the prices of 
coins and paper money.

They are still around [in business], they used to concentrate just on coins but 
they have expanded more into paper money and especially sports cards.  I have to laugh 
at the hype I read in their ads, some of the things they say are so ridiculous like 
modern proof sets to explode in price soon, things like that.

I get ads from Chattanooga Coin about once a month, they are interesting to read 
but I don't take too seriously what they say about "unsearched hoards" that they keep 
finding.  The "Coin and Sports Card Wholesaler" is the paper they put out with all kinds 
of great "deals".  Prices are too high and postage and shipping makes small purchases 
not worth the effort IMO.

What ever you do...don't buy from Chattanooga Coin Co.!!!  They sell bags of 5000 
wheaties (supposed to be unsearched) Yea Right! For $139.00 plus $20.00 S&H.  But your bag 
of pennies will be mostly culls and G-VG common date wheats.  Almost like they're selling 
you their [expletive] bag of discards!!!  Not something from the "Indiana Hoard".  
Furthermore, they should be reported to the BBB!!!

Never buy from The Chatanooga Coin Co!!!
I recently bought a supposadly "UNSEARCHED" bag of 5000 Lincoln wheat cents for what amounted to after S&H $180.
What I  received was a bag of mostly AG/G/VG Common date cents, a couple rolls of CULLS and a roll of Cleaned cents.
This "'so-called' Indiana hoard" is a hoard of bulls**t.
The Coins on SHOP AT HOME are Chatanooga Coin Co. as well so I'd stay away from them also.
I think I'll take up another hobby where there aren't as many "rip-off" artists around trying to make a fast buck.
I never had this problem when I was a kid!!!
But then I bought from a local dealer who wouldn't sell me my first coin until I had at least read the "Red Book" and then I still was never "cheated" for what I bought.
That leads me to believe that people should ONLY BUY from LOCAL Dealers that they can trust and make the purchase "SIGHT SEEN".  Nuff said.

I've been burned by them before.  I bought some "BU" Walkers that were cleaned trash from them.

i being a person that takes a person at his word fell into the tv coin show traps 3 different times duh.
shop@home and vcc sell unsearched walkers in ef  in all dates both companies sent me 100 walkers ag @best all 1940 and 41 
dates {what are those odds} billed my credit card day of purchase took 6 weeks to receive and 
when i sent them back it took them 4 weeks to credit me credit cards.
so they had use of my money for 10 weeks. are these coin shows related how do they get their coins this is straight out lying for profit on tv { jim baker went to prison for basicly the same thing.
the other one is the panda shopping network.prices are at least 250% above redbook, no law against making super profits i am envious i guess 
but i did purchase coins still have not received them 6 weeks now their customer service is a recording saying they are busy and will call back.
i am the fool but i watch still as other people buy $250.00 morgans for 1,200 all night long.
when you have time can you e-mail me back explaining how they get their coins,are these coin"shows " related ie chattanooga coins, the professor, etc.
paying grossly to much for coins is mine and other idiot consumers fault.
but lying about unsearched and grossly overgraded coins ie:30 points and claims of only 300 left in the world etc: is paramount to wire fraud if done on the airwaves

Editor's Comment:  It seems that Chattanooga is a very bad telemarketer who always tries to rip-off anyone they can on the run (or on the fly)...STAY AWAY FROM CHATTANOOGA COIN COMPANY AT ALL COSTS!

Comments about Coast To Coast Coins

Of all the transcations I did with Coast to Coast, only one was 
satisfactory, and that was with an 1884-CC Morgan Dollar.  It was 
confirmed by one of the ANACS people at a coin show that it graded 
MS-63.  I was happy to find out about that, but many 'CC' dollars with 
that date are expected to be in MS.  All the other transactions I had 
with Coast to Coast Coins are less than satisfactory.

I've only had one transaction with one of the "bad" dealers - Coast 
to Coast Coins.  I had a satisfactory transaction - I ordered a 1917 BU 
Standing Liberty quarter.  It was indeed BU - an MS-60, a few hits and a 
very tiny scratch on the reverse, none distracting, but no wear, nice 
white.  Not a fantastic coin, but exactly what I expected.

I think I've bought stuff from [this dealer] without problems, 
but I can't vouch for [this dealer] in any sort of general manner.

Coast to Coast - bought a few coins (again up to $150) and returned 
most for replacement because of misgrading or damage.  Replacements were 
acceptable.  Out postage again though.

Coast to Coast just seems to be another place that sells "BU" stuff, a 
big warning flag in my mind.  What's the complaint about them?

Editor's Response:  The "BU" Stuff is very likely to be cleaned, or AU, or something 
that is not a true BU.

I've done just that and their response was that they do not believe in numerical grading, only in adjectives!  
The only two coins I bought from them were "Select BU" sliders.  In other words, AU.

Before buying from Coast to Coast, have them explain to you how "Select BU", "Very Choice BU", etc. would 
translate into the MS grading scale.  I would be interested in what their response is.  My guess is that they will tell 
you they have their own "unique" grading system.

I ordered the 1903-P Morgan from Coast to Coast for $19.95 figuring that even at MS-60 it would fit into my  collection.
I received a dipped and cleaned coin grading no better than XF.
Then I had to send it back to them insured and paid $5 in postage both ways.
I stuck a letter in the return inquiring about splitting the postage costs but they just sent me the $19.95 back.
Don't waste your money here.

I've probably lost a few hundred bucks on bad dealers such as Coast to Coast,
since I've only been collecting for a few years, and am quite young like yourself (19 years).

I bought some silver dollars from Coast-to-Coast and checked then out through the 
plastic they came in.  They looked good except they looked like poor strikes.  After 
I removed them from the plastic (they won't take the coins back if they are removed 
from the plastic holder) I could feel the dipping solution on the coin.  At that 
point, I presumed the coin had been in circulation somewhat, not BU as advertised.

Once ordered a 1903 $1, advertised very select BU, coin was at best a XF-AU.
Only $19.95 plus $2 shipping, sent it back immediately asking for $21.95
returned plus a not so nice note about grading coins properly.  Received only
$19.95 weeks later.

Comments about DocsCoins

Someone on the COINS newsgroup got this e-mail spam from this 
disreputable dealer:
Date:  97-04-24 10:25:57 EDT
From:  R& (probably forged/fake)
('To:' part snipped)
Own a genuine 100 year old MORGAN SILVER DOLLAR for only $11.95 plus 
$3.00 shipping and handling!  Each coin is in circulated condition and 
guaranteed to be 100 years [old] or older.  Not minted since 1921, and 
these MORGAN SILVER DOLLARS will never be minted again.  Due to 
availability, we urge you to order now!
E-mail orders to: (include phone)
(Next few parts snipped out)
If you would like to be removed from our mailing list, please type 
"REMOVE" in subject box and e-mail to!

Editor's Comment:  That e-mail spam is nothing more than telemarketing 
trash.  Remember I will not buy any of your products if you send e-mail 
spam.  Enough said.

Comments about Family Of Eagles

Editor's Comment:  That dealer is probably not a real numismatic 
dealer, but they are trying to prey on the unsuspecting public about 
their "investment" gold coins, such as 1/10 oz.  Gold Eagles of Maple 
Leafs, and they sold them for more than double the going price that 
reputable dealers have been selling for.  They also claim to work to 
reduce the national debt, but that is totally misleading.  Also, the 
spamming part is that they were using as many keywords as possible to 
get more hits for their web pages and lure more customers into their 
trap.  Is this criminal?  There's a good chance that this is criminal.  
Also, another notable event to tell you is that Family Of Eagles was 
expelled from a Florida coin show, apparently for not holding a Florida 
Resale License (or Florida Resale Number).  This almost proves FOE's 
scheme as criminal and they are certainly almost "scumbags" in my 
opinion.  At all costs, avoid Family Of Eagles!  If you don't believe me, 
go to DejaNews and type 'Family Of 
Eagles' and you'll see a lot of messages/threads about them.  Read them 
and judge FOE for yourselves and you'll soon realize that my judgement 
about FOE is on target.

I have hated this company for quite some time.  It destroys realtionships, lies to people and try to con good 
people into using friends and family for profit.

Also, just an added goodie.  If the FOE people are paying off the national debt why would they pay twice the price of gold 
to buy it from a foreign Government.  This would make the US lose in the exchange.  Oh well, just another of the number of 
many reasons why FOE is a scam!

I got involved with Family of Eagles a while back, realized my mistake, and had 
to sue them in small claims court for a refund.  They settled before the court 
date and I got my money back.  I would like to get the news out to others who have 
been defrauded so that they can do the same.  Family of Eagles will go out of 
business if they are forced to actually abide by the law.  That would be nice.  
E-mail me and let me know if you have ideas of how to get the word out to as many 
people as possible.  People need to know that they can prevail in court against
this company.

Editor's Comment:  I surely hope Family Of Eagles is going to get busted very soon...
for the rip-offs they have been trying to pull on honest, law-abiding, hard-working 

Comments about Federal Coin Exchange

Re Federal Coin Exchange, in EVERY CASE this dealer sent me AU, harshly cleaned,
MERCURY DIMES when I ordered their  "BU" or "GEM BU" Mercury's.
Sigh.  I guess this is just the way business is conducted now.

Comments about Gobrecht Numismatics

My dealings with Gobrecht involved exactly one transaction.  I
bought a coin labeled as an XF 1/2 cent from them for the low price of
$60 (sometimes you can find them in that grade at that price).  The coin
that arrived graded F at best.  I sent it back.  They credited my card
(it only took 2 billing cycles) for all but the cost of shipping (about
$7).  I will never order from them again, but consider my $7 lesson an
inexpensive one, all things said.

Editor's Comment:  I should also note that he has also talked with others
who have had the same problems with them [he means Gobrecht

I ordered a Vietnam Veterans BU Memorial Dollar from them and 
they told me it was in stock and would go out the next day.  After three 
weeks and no coin, they told me they were trying to locate one.  It took 
me 4 weeks to get my money back and only after I contacted VISA.

I stopped doing business with Gobrecht because any coin costing 
more than $10.00 was almost always overgraded.  That is why their prices 
are so good; they tend to overgrade coins.  The last straw from Gobrecht 
was an "uncirculated" Morgan Dollar that was graded as AU53 by a major 
grading service.  I don't make these mistakes anymore; I hope others 
won't either.

I ordered 5 BU Morgan Silver Dollars from Gobrecht Numismatics.  
Well I know a little about Morgans and this is what I got.  Two nice 
AUs--two XFs---and even a VF.  I guess I should have known an ad price 
of $10.79 for BU Morgans was too good to be true.  I'm glad I didn't order 
a roll like I was going to, because I just don't like returning coins.  I simply 
won't buy from them anymore.

My experience was similar.  The coin I bought was 2 grades below 
advertised.  I paid with a credit card and it took four months for the credit to 
show up on my statement.  I don't believe they really care whether you keep the 
coin or not.  If they have the free use of your money for 3 or 4 months, gathering 
interest, and they're doing this to thousands of people at any one time, it could 
mean 20-50 thousand a year in accrued interest.

I bought two Peace Dollars, 1924-S and 1927-S in "Gem BU", and got 
harshly cleaned AUs.  Perhaps the "BU" meant "Buffed Up".  To put it in short, DO 

I work about 5 miles from Gobrecht and have attempted to purchase coins 
from them.  I can give you a 100% guarantee that they will overgrade their coins, usually 
by at least 15 MS grade points.  They are so ridiculous that they would be an excellent 
example of, not rogue, but criminal.  The majority of the 2 dozen reputable coin dealers 
around the DC area say the same thing about Gobrecht.  Scam, scam, scam....

Gobrecht must be the world champion overgraders, if they overgrade by 15 MS points, 
seeing how there are only ten points between the top and bottom of the MS scale!

Gobrecht almost always dips the coins and their grading is anywhere from 2 to 4 levels 
above the actual grade.  They tried to sell me an 1893-S Morgan dollar that they claimed was VF/XF 
when in fact it was barely a G-10 [VG-10?].  I stopped by their office and the same goes for all 
their coins.  These people are genuine crooks.

My experience [with Gobrecht] (one only) is that their coins are overgraded by at least one grade 
and the coin has probably been dipped, cleaned or enhanced in some fashion.

I saw an ad from Gobrecht Numismatics for XF Large Cents.  The ad said get three different 
dates for $44.00.  I ordered two lots (6 coins) and the results when they arrived were:
(2) Two extra fine, both of which had been cleaned and looked like brass.
(2) Two that would be graded weak Very Fine.
(1) One nice fine.
(1) one Good-8 [VG-8?].
The deal was too good to be true and it was!  I returned the coins and they gave me a prompt refund 
less shipping charges.

They [Gobrecht Numismatics] are one of the many mail order firms I have had problems with.

I am very angry with Gobrecht.  I sent the order on July 20, my check cleared July 27, and I am still 
waiting for my fairly small order!  They told me they were out of an item I had ordered and instead of shipping 
all other items, they decided to wait to avoid extra shipping costs.  Each time I called Cust.  Service to check 
on my order, I was told 'it will ship in the next 2 days...' Once I called, the Cust.  Service dept.  was closed 
because 'the A/C is down and it's bad for the computers', but the order line was open as usual, hmmmmm.  I don't 
think I will be ordering again from Gobrecht.

Gobrecht has some nice publications of items they have for sale, but I am not too trusting to purchase 
from them.  My reason, a few local collectors near me, have been ripped off considerably.

I have purchased a couple of coins from Gobrecht.  They were overgraded by 1/2 to 1 full grade.  I sent all 
but one of them back.  The apparently original ch VF bust half dollar (sold as ch XF) for $39 was a reasonable buy, but 
it was the second one they sent me.  I suspect they had a bucket of not worth slabbing bust halves and were just grabbing 
them at random.

Thanks for starting this discussion [about Gobrecht].  You probably saved me $200 worth of aggravation.  I had 
a test order all ready to go.

Gobrecht  -  Should be closed and put out of business for fraud.  Ordered a
1937-D 3 legged  buffalo at $395 which was suppose to be a AU, as advertised
in COINage magazine.  Great price for a AU.  What I got was a Fine/VF which
had been dipped/cleaned.  Returned it and asked for an AU.  Got a second coin
which was the same as the first.  Returned it and asked for my postage and
insurance, which was now over $10.  Got no response other that a charge card
credit memo slip for my original price only - no postage.
A few month's later, there is the same ad for the same coin and same price in
COINage again.  I wrote to COINage about my experience and reported it to them
per the rules they outline in the mag's fine print.  Didn't hear anything so I
called COINage and spoke to their consumer affairs person.  He seemed semi-
interested and said he would shop Gorbecht to see if he got a similarily over
graded coin and said he would contact me.  I never heard from him and didn't
think I ever would.
Gobrecht buys usually 6 full pages of Ads.  Do you really think COINage is
going to dump 6 pages of ads ????

I live in the Silver Spring Area, where the main office of this place is. I've never 
dealt with them by mail-order, however when I go there (now rarely) to find any specific coin, 
I've noticed that they either don't have the time for such a small deal (e.g. $5 Indian heads) 
but would rather push something more expesenive than what you want to buy.  If that isn't enough, 
then their grading system is the "esoteric" brilliant uncirculated, etc., and when you 
specifically ask for their opinion via the MS system, they wont tell you. Bottom line, 
the deals look great but you get  what you pay for, and that really isn't as good as you 
hope it would be.

Comments about Great American Coins

Yeah...I've had trouble with Great American Coins.  Sent them a cashier's check 
for some coins 7 weeks ago...they acknowledged they got the check and say "we'll be 
sending those coins out tomorrow".....they've said that four times now.  I finally called 
to cancel the order.  I can't wait to see how long it takes to get my money back...So far 
it's been two weeks.

Comments about "Dr. Robert Greco"

We received a nice phone order around Thanksgiving for some slabbed
Saints $20 from a Dr. Robert Greco of Florida. The sale came to $1890,
and he put it on a Visa card. I called the Visa authorization number,
since this was a large transaction. They gave me a validation code, so
we shipped the order.  About 2 weeks ago Visa sent me a letter that
the card number is no good and they had already debited my account
for $2223. The extra is because it is from a Norway bank and they are
charging ME for 2 currency conversions!!!!  What a Christmas gift!!!
We are a small coin shop lucky to clear couple of thousand a year
after bills and taxes. Am I stupid to think that if the Visa 800
number approved the card, and issued me an authorization number, that
I had nothing to worry about?

I hope that among everything else, you reported this case to the 
FBI. That so-called "Dr. Greco" is engaged in interstate wire fraud, a 
very serious federal crime, and the FBI will undoubtedly interview 
every party involved. Your VISA service company may decide its better 
not to take advantage of you once they hear the feds come a-calling.

We just got an unsolicited fax order for about $5000 worth of
gold and platinum coins from a 'doctor' in Longwood, Florida.
He gives a credit card number and wants the coins shipped overnight
to his 'clinic' so he can have them before he leaves for an
'important medical symposium'.
This smells like a fraud, and when you ship a credit card order to someone without the cardholders signature, you are responsible if turns out to be a fraud!!! That "doctor" sent orders to dozens of dealers on is completely bogus. This has been widely publicized on "Coinnet" recently. Several dealers have reported getting careful...

Comments about Aaron Gurney

Editor's Note:  There are currently at least 18 complaints about him regarding his eBay auctions.  
To find out more, go to the Mail Order Fraud on eBay page or 
see his recent feedback at his eBay feedback 
page and see for yourself.

Comments about Jim Hale

On July 27, 1997 I gave Jim L. Hale three coins on memo.  They were :
1, 1983 Roosevelt Proof Dime ( No S )  NGC PR 69 Ultra Cameo
335036-006($700), 1, 1983 P Lincoln cent Doubled Die Reverse 1-R-IV
NGC 66 RD $230, 1, 1959 Lincoln cent Repunched Mintmark 003 ( wildly
misplaced MM) MS 65 $70 for a total of $1000.
He signed the memo, "Due 8/20/97  Jim Hale".
I called him on August 19 to see how he did at the Cleveland Coin
Show.  He said it was terrible and that he would return the coins 
or bring them to the Central States Show in Harvey on September 5, 1997.  
He was not at the show.
On September 6, 1997, a collector brought the No S dime over to our
table.  I checked the slab number, and it was the coin I had given
On September 24 at 1:47 PM I called Jim L. Hale.  He said he would
return the coins.  I asked him how he was going to return the No S
Roosevelt Proof, since it had been sold.  He said, "What do you want,
blood."  I asked him to send the money or enough coins to over the 
$1000.  He said he would.
I mailed him a certified letter on October 27, 1997.  It was returned
I did not want to post this email, but I feel I must make collectors
and other dealers aware of this problem.

Comments about Harold Weitz

Placed order for a roll of BU PL morgans by phone about May 4.  Was told they 
would ship in 7-10 days. (Red flag - Why so long??)  Credit card was charged immediately.  
Did not receive by May 25, called and was told they would ship the next day.  Was also 
told there was illnesses and accidents in the office preventing earlier shipping.  Faxed 
a letter June 2 (dated June 1, copy on request) stating that coins had not been received and 
would be refused on delivery.  Coins arrived June 5, having been shipped June 2.  I accepted shipment 
and inspected the coins.  Coins were not PL except in spots, except for 1 PL reverse.  
Coins have been returned; I do not know if credit card has been refunded yet, but I doubt it.
So, too long to ship, too quick to charge, items not as described. Why would I use these guys again??
Hope this was useful.

Comments about John Paul Sarosi

I ordered once from him a couple of years ago, and that was enough for me.  I 
ordered an MS-63 RED Indian Head Cent and an EF Indian Cent.  Both were at good prices.  
In my opinion, the MS-63 was not even close to being uncirculated, and I would've graded it 
EF, cleaned.  The other coin that was supposed to be EF was indeed EF, and I had no problem 
with it.  I returned the MS coin, and got a refund with no problem.  In my return letter, 
I explained that I thought the coin was circulated and cleaned, and I asked him to look at 
it again before putting it back in his stock.  When I went to CSNS a month or so later -- 
in Indianapolis, I believe -- I took a look at his stock and he had just put the coin 
right back in there.

Although he and his niece advertise in Coin World, these two dealers are rude and 
have a nasty attitude, with customer service which leaves a lot to be desired.  In 25 years 
dealing with advertisers, they are by far the worst experience you could imagine.  I have 
lodged a complaint with Coin World, and I've been informed that mine is not the first 
documenting their attitudes!

I want to mention one other company while I'm at it.  [John] Paul Sarosi out of 
Johnstown, Pa.  He is another one who mails out overgraded garbage and hopes you don't send it 
back.  He is typical of a lot of dealers in the business.

I bought an 1852 $10 in EF from John Paul Sarosi once.  If anything, it was undergraded.  
He also sent me a silver round gratis, without my asking for it.  One coin is a very small sample, but 
I believe his grading is honest and consistent.  If I was to buy inexpensive U.S. coins, e.g. a short set 
of MS63 Mercury Dimes, I would consider JPS first.

Editor's Comment:  It seems that JPS probably grades circulated coins correctly, but for MS coins, his grading 
is probably iffy (and/or inconsistent), IMHO.

Good old John Paul notified a friend of mine that he does not want to do business with variety collectors 
as they take up too much of his time and do not spend enough money.  This was told to a dentist who had already done 
business with him in the past.  My buddy and I will tell anyone who asks, or wants to listen, that he is not a friendly 
dealer to the true collectors amongst us.  He apparently only wants people to come to his table and throw hundred dollar 
bills at him and accept what he hands back over the counter in exchange.

There are people like that in what passes for numismatics.  They despise coin collectors and love know 
nothing wealthy "investors" who will (they think) make them rich too.  Doctors, lawyers, celebrities.  As long as they 
are not "coin collectors" and will swallow the snake oil pitch of the day.

I have ordered 3 different grades of Barber Halves from him in the past.  That was 
the only order they ever got from me and 2 of the halves were returned.  I did get my money back 
promptly, however, you know as well as I do that some dealers are just hoping you won't return and 
accept them.

I never thought anyone would dare to undergrade [overgrade (??)] severly Barber coins because I feel 
that the grading on these is very strict and tough to wander on (notably in lower grades).  His ads are 
tempting, but I resist these days and do my business locally.

I see this guy's ads in Coin World.  He lists coins from average to pretty nice, all using the 70 point 
grading system.  None are slabbed.  All are at about bluesheet bid prices.
Now that I realize that his stuff is probably overgraded by 1/2 to 1 full grade notch or so, on the "you can't get 
something for nothing" theory.

Editor's Note:  If the price is too good for the grade, the coin may have been abused in some way. :-(

The first deal was for a Morgan Dollar in BU.  Ugliest coin I had ever seen.  Sent it back the same day I 
received it and got a refund.  Case closed.  I decided I would never do business with him again.
Well, he indirectly got me anyway.  I purchased a 79-O MS 63 from a guy on the internet.  When I received it I saw that he 
had left John Paul Sarosi's label on it.  I should have sent it back immediately.  Instead I decided to send it in to PCI 
to prove a point.  Sure enough--AU58.  This guy deserves the numismatic death penalty.  he has been doing this for 
He puts on a front that he is an honest dealer, and you won't hear a harsh word about him among dealers in Pittsburgh.  No 
wonder.  He buys everything in sight from them because he can make money by simply putting a higher grade on them and 
mailing them out to the uninformed public.  He operates by the law of averages.  Throw out hundreds of overgraded coins and 
hope that most don't come back.  Just keep sending them out over and over again until he finds a sucker.  This guy should 
be investigated.  He is a disgrace to the hobby and should be brought out into the open for what he is.
The problem is that Sarosi is well liked because he is mainly a buyer.  You won't hear any one of them speak 
poorly of him.  He retains his good standing by being active in the PAN show.  He will buy a ton of stuff from the 
dealers there.  He only preys on the uninformed public.  I will be at that show and I am going to make it a point to drop 
by his table to see if he is just another mail order crook or if he will screw someone face to face.  The PAN people should 
be real proud to have this guy as chairman.

I didn't spend much time with Sarosi, but I noticed he had another 1886-O Morgan
(which I am always looking for) in BU that was a joke.
I told a dealer friend of mine that I would give him a fifty dollar profit to go buy it and guarantee me it was BU.
He wouldn't even go look.

Comments about M. Earl Kennedy

I won an auction lot of 3 1970-S Small Date Cents in MS67RD. 
When I received the coins, two of the three coins slipped out of their 2
x 2's and the third probably graded MS65RD or MS66RD at best, IMO.  The other
2 coins probably graded somewhere between MS63RD and MS64RD.  Also, all
three of the coins were Large Date cents, and not the small dates.  I sent
three (or four) e-mails to this guy and the first two (or three) he didn't
respond to and the third (or fourth) bounced.  Apparently, I also
received an e-mail from another person who won that same lot (It was a
Dutch auction at eBay), and told me that he had trouble trying to
contact that person and that he also received Large Date 1970-S cents
and not Small Date 1970-S cents.  But what is strange is that the other
winner of the lot got his money back.  So I'm out $81.10 for 3 coins
that are worth only $0.50 at most.  Also, he had a rating of positive 11
or 12 before he himself was booted from eBay.  Currently, it is at positive 8.
Unfortunately, I think my $81.10 is gone forever because of this crook.

Also, I should note that he has run this 1970-S Small Date scam another way, by offering
the 1970-S Small Date over Large Date cent.  The guy who paid $43 for that coin also was taken.
There seems to be at least 4 confirmed cases (including mine) of fraud from Mr. Kennedy.

Comments about LGNCapital Management (aka LevGold)

Editor's Comment:  This guy has been spamming Usenet and especially 
rec.collecting.coins with his ads such as 'Proof 66 Franklins:  Unique 
Opportunity' or something like that back in '97.  I have enclosed one of the ads from 
this spammer:
---Spam #1---
From: (LGNCapital)
Newsgroups:  rec.collecting.coins
Subject:  **Franklin Half Complete Sets**
Date:  25 Apr 1997 21:27:39 GMT
(Some more headers)
Franklin Half Complete Sets graded by NGC only
* 1952 - PROOF 67 - $499
* 1953 - MS 65 - $85
* 1953 - PROOF 67 - $179
* 1954 - MS 65 - $75
* 1954 - PROOF 67 - $99
* 1954S - MS 65 - $50
(And so forth, snip, snip, snip)
Also, the spammer gave info on where his company is located...
This above spam is one of four ads I saved from that scum...
Therefore:  Don't do business with LGNCapital!!!!!!!!!!!!!
---End Spam #1---

Editor's Comment:  It seems that people got tired about this guy's spamming, 
so the AOL account that is referenced here is now gone.
The last post made by that AOL address was on May 10, 1998.

Comments about Liberty Rare Coins in Plano, Texas

Initial Post:
Bought 33 U.S. $2.50 raw coins from them. ANACS grading revealed 26 of them were damaged, overgraded , scratched, Ex-jewelry, graffiti, etc. Dealer refuses to take back coins, adjust price, or anything to rectify this. Anybody else
dealt with them? They are in Plano, Tx.
Response Post:
Is this some redheaded troll named Pike?  Warning Danger!  You're lucky they were even genuine
Response to the Response Post:
You got it. It's David Pike. I am currently filing legal action against this scam artist. Anyone interested in class action, let me know.

Comments about "Bobby Reno Livingston"

This was featured on America's Most Wanted on Saturday, March 14, 1998.
It involved a company run by a person who uses an alias of "Bobby Reno Livingston," called Godey Girls.
He is a slick telemarketer who is alleged to have bilked his followers out of between three and four million dollars, with his collectible items, inlcuding his exclusive Godey Girls silver "coins", which were sold at $350, but in reality only worth $10. For more info on this case, go to this Web address:

Comments about "Stuart Long"

Any parties having dealings with the Barnett Bank in Tallahassee, Florida by a
person representing himself to be an officer of the bank ordering coins or
bullion should be aware that there is a fraudulant scheme being perpetrated by a
person representing himself as STUART LONG.
Contact David Whitehurst of Barnett Bank IMMEDIATELY if someone representing
himself as STUART LONG has contacted you.  David Whitehurst can be contacted at
(850) 561-1910 or faxed at (850) 561-1965.
This fradulant deal has been attempted on ABBOTT'S in Birmingham, MI and
SILVERTOWNE in Winchester, IN.

Comments about Mount Vernon Coin Company

Mount Vernon:  Purchased Gem Brilliant Uncirculated 1889 Morgan....when I received the coin it was F-XF at best.

Mount Vernon - Have bought coins there (up to about $150 each) and 
had to return most because of grading or damage but replacements met my expectations.  
Again, out postage though for return.

My first (and last) purchase from Mt.  Vernon Coin [Company] was a 1921  Morgan Dollar set in select BU which was AU.  Didn't even waste my time sending them back.  Big mistake.  That is exactly what they wanted - a buyer who doesn't 
return their garbage.

Mt.  Vernon gave me VERY fast service -- I sent the order on July 20, my check cleared 
July 28, and I received my coins on July 31!!  All coins were as advertised and of very high quality.

Editor's Comment:  Hmm, I assume you were buying modern mint products like silver eagles, as the price 
for whatever quality (AU or BU) is almost the same, IMHO.  The bad part is about the collector coins being 
overgraded, cleaned, etc.

I once bought a bunch of "BU" silver dollars, for my inventory, from Mount Vernon on a 
great price, so I thought.  All of the coins were AU and dipped.  I never did business with them again.  
All of the coins were sent back!

I recently had to return some coins that were definitely overgraded to the following company:  
Mount Vernon Company
[address and other stuff snipped]
Every coin I ordered was 1 to 1 and a half grades lower than advertised.  I will not be dealing with this 
company again.  The best way we can deal with unscrupulous characters is to apply economic pressure to them.  
I hope some of you will join me in avoiding doing business with this company, and others like them.

Mount Vernon....the rumors associated with them are good and bad.  I have not had the pleasure to 
become a customer of theirs, but in given time, I will get something from them and post any flaunts in their 
ad for 'this coin'.

I purchased a "Gem BU Red" 1907 Indian Cent from them.  Found out that it was a Cleaned AU.

There may or may not be one in Annapolis Maryland with ads in the middle of Coin World (very likely to be 
Mount Vernon) that may or may not sell sliders as BU.

As for Mount Vernon:  I have ordered several times and although  I wouldn't say "do not order from them", I 
would say it is true that some are dipped and/or overgraded.  I believe that a lot of those large dealers use mail 
sales as a chance to use the 60/40 rule.  60% of the coins they send you are just right and 40% are iffy.  Thus they send 
some coins that can't be sold in person and you may or may not take the time and effort to return them.  This, I think is 
their gamble.  Yet, the prices are great and most of the coins are nice, so one tends to reorder from these large 

I have bought some coins for my kids from Mt.  Vernon and have had mixed results with the orders.  Honestly, 
I have returned about 75% of what is ordered and requested a refund.  I agree that if any issue is going to be brought 
forth here on the newsgroup, folks need to be explicit with their problem(s) instead of vague innuendos even if they have a 
valid complaint.  I guess that you could say that I have learned my lessons and quit buying from the larger coin houses 
and prefer to stick with the smaller dealers who have proven to me to be more honest in their business dealings.

I agree.  I've ordered from them and had the same experience.  I ordered some BU Morgans and they sent me good 
sliders.  I was not happy but it would have cost me more to send them back than it was worth.  I took them to a local 
dealer and he told me they were mail order BU's.  Nice looking coins, but not BU or original.  I've also gotten some nice 
stuff from them that were original.  All the big ones are alike.  Big ads need big sales.  The prices are so good that you 
hate to complain.

Re Mt. Vernon, I ordered "BU" Morgans and got AU cleaned trash.

Re Mt. Vernon, in EVERY CASE this dealer sent me AU, harshly cleaned, MERCURY DIMES when I ordered their "BU" or "GEM BU" Mercury's.  Sigh.  I guess this is just the way business is conducted now.

It seems Mount Vernon Coin company has gotten a name for themselves.  I 
purchased 2 choice BU Indian cents from them a while back at a very good price.  Both 
were borderline AU at best and cleaned. Getting a refund was easy as squeezing 
blood from a stone. I see their ad for cheap choice BU red indian cents in 
Coins magazine...  *sigh*

Comments about Tom Newton

Tom Newton on Auction Universe- username TomNewton...
I bid on an PF68 NGC Ike "cameo" "brilliant white"... won the bid- sent
in 18$. (money order)
3 weeks later, recieved the coin, it was in an NGC slab marked PF68
cameo... BUT it was pitiful, milky, piss-yellow, and the slab had been
obviously whacked a couple times with a hammer, no kidding.
I complained about it and told him I had never returned a coin before,
but believed he misrepresented it. He e-mailed back a wimpy brief
message saying return it for a replacement (he claims he accidentally
sent me the wrong coin) so I did, ins. for 20$ cost $1.53 postage- I
said, ok... I'll give you a chance to make it right. He PROMISED to send
me an example AS DESCRIBED in his comments, (those were HIS words after
all right?)
over a month went by and nothing. I e-mailed after 2 weeks asking when I
could expect it, and he never even gave me the courtesy of a reply. 3
times I e-mailed him, nothing.
Yesterday a check arrived for 15$ marked "refund for the PF68 Ike" with
no note of apology or explanation- I expected him to send me a coin,
instead I get "reimbursed" $4.53 short.
I put a negative comments about this on his ratings on AU- first time
I've ever given anyone negative ratings- and I have done a LOT of
business there. My ratings are flawless. You know me well enough to know
I wouldn't go after someone if I didn't think they deserved it.
Upon investigation, he has questionable ratings that if I had taken time
to read before bidding- I may have avoided him altogether. I had won two
other bids of his after this one- but told him based on the treatment I
recieved he could print them out, roll them up, and "you know what" ok
I hated like heck to do that, but I don't appreciate it. this guy is a
disgrace to numismatics and coin dealers. I nominate him for the BAD
DEALER and BAD TRADER list- I'll leave the DP up to you. In my opinion-
he's only buying low and selling high, jumping on the bandwagon of
certified coins. Now, you know as well as I, if you describe a coin as
"white, brilliant, spotless, cameo, etc..." IT SHOULD BE JUST THAT or
it's misrepresentation, no matter what it says "on the slab"... this is 
a joke really. Lesson- just because it's certified don't mean it's not a
ugly dog. It's the dealer's RESPONSIBILITY for sight unseen trading to
ACCURATELY describe the coin no matter what.
Keep up the good work Nick- I certainly appreciate it. I thought about it last night- IF I had been a "newbie"... how would I feel about the hobby in general? Knowing better, I realize this guy is a scumbag and bad apple- but how many good folks are being screwed around and forced out of the hobby before they have a chance to be exposed to the "good guys"??? we'll never know will we??? It's only 20$ and to me the lesson is worth far nore than that- but to a kid starting out, it could be a death knoll that kills the zeal and snuffs the fire. Know what I mean? I bid on one of Tom Newton's coins listed on Auction Universe. After a month, no coin, no email. I inquired and got a terse message about UPS losing the coin. Two more weeks, no refund, no explanation. I send more email. No response. Another week, another email, still nothing. Repeat. Finally, I email telling him that I will explain the situation to the auction site. I get a terse response apologizing for the situation and an offer of another coin with the same grade or a refund. I opt for the refund. This was about two weeks ago. No check, no email (sigh).

Comments about North Carolina Potpourri Gems and Coinage has had his account suspended by e-bay.  He is bad news, be warned.
Company is North Carolina Potpourri Gems and Coinage, Box 7006, Statesville, N.C. 28288.

Editor's Note:  I read his feedback file on eBay, and sure enough he is very bad news.  
The URL is:

Comments about Paul Sims

Paul Sims - bought a 1799 Eagle in XF-AU condition for $8450. 
Got the coin and it was beautiful EXCEPT that it had a pinch on the rim
at 4 o'clock.  Sims won't let you remove the coin from the holder.  I
wasn't sure if it was an adjustment mark or damage so I sent it to the
ANA.  They were supposed to get permission (luckily they videotape this
so there's no question of coin change).  Sims was POed.  ANA confirmed
it was damaged after leaving the mint.  They contacted Sims and I was
able to get a refund.  Saw the same coin advertised a few months later
for $8950 and it sold!  Have bought other coins from them (though
nowhere that expensive) and have probably returned about 10% of them. 
Only bitch is that they don't refund postage on overgraded coins (yours
or theirs!)

Editor's Comment:  This is a very powerful comment, and maybe it will
help potential numismatic customers to make wiser choices in selecting a
dealer to purchase from.

Paul Sims advertised BU Mercury dimes in Coin World.  IMHO they 
ranged from XF to uncirculated, but they were all harshly cleaned.  I 
guess his return policy and the trend of large coin dealers to sell 
overdipped AU as BU keeps this from being an abnormal occurance.

Paul Sims:  I sent them a cashier's check for proof sets.  Two 
weeks later. they still hadn't sent the sets saying that they had to 
"wait for the check to clear".

I think I've bought stuff from [this dealer] without problems, 
but I can't vouch for [this dealer] in any sort of general manner.

I bought a 1928-P Peace $ in "Premium Quality BU"....Turned out 
to be a cleaned AU.

I have had some dealings with Paul Sims, Inc.  Generally, I was 
unimpressed.  My purchases were limited to Morgan Dollars, and even for those 
dates considered "tough" because of weak strike, so-so luster, etc., their 
"Premium Quality Brilliant Uncirculated" examples were often disappointing.  again, you DO 
get what you pay for!

Paul Sims, on the other hand, is a test of wills and perseverance.  Coins are 
overgraded and typically cleaned or dipped.  Send it back for a replacement and a similar 
over-graded coin comes back.  Not worth the effort, time and postage.

I've done just that and their response was that they do not believe in numerical grading, only in adjectives!  
The only two coins I bought from them were "Select BU" sliders.  In other words, AU.

Before buying from Paul Sims, have them explain to you how "Select BU", "Very Choice BU", etc. would translate 
into the MS grading scale.  I would be interested in what their response is.  My guess is that they will tell you they 
have their own "unique" grading system.
If I had found and read your [ie, my] page a couple of months ago, I would not have ordered anything from Paul 
Sims.  My order, from them, took 45 days to be delivered and what I received was 2 rolls of Mercury dimes with 20% 
culls.  I did just send another order to Paul Sims for 4 BU Mercs, but this may have been a mistake.  I have not received 
them yet, but I can just imagine how "shiny" these cleaned beauties will be.

Paul Sims - Thumbs DOWN and I mean WAY DOWN.  Sold me a polished VF gold coin as AU-BU in my early days of 
collecting and I'll never get over it.

Have made several purchases from Paul Sims and have been very happy with them.  Plan to do more business with 
them in the future.  They delivered what I ordered on time.

Editor's Comment:  It seems that he might just be ordering modern proof sets, Silver Eagles, etc.  Or maybe he just 
didn't check how Paul Sims grade their coins.  Makes me wonder...

Paul Sims, for example, was a very rude dealer at a coin show last year and did not care to talk to me about 
any of the coins I was interested in buying.  I have received a few mailings from him and tore them up and placed those 
mailings in a recycle bin.

SEVERAL years ago, I bought several coins from Paul Sims, Inc.  Then, as now, he ran gorgeous display ads in 
CW offering attractive material at remarkable prices.  The stuff I bought from him looked good to me at the time, so I 
was a happy repeat customer for several years.
During those years, I learned a lot about coin grading and coin cleaning.  I also learned that many of the coins I bought 
from Paul Sims, Inc.  had been dipped or cleaned, and that the Choice BU's I had bought were actually graded AU or XF.
I don't buy from Paul Sims Inc.  anymore.  The above is my experience with this firm.  HOWEVER this does not mean that my 
experience is the experience of anyone else.  Also, this was many years ago, and anyone can change.  I have no recent 
experience of how Paul Sims Inc.  does business these days, and my experience years ago could have been unique.  The ads 
from this firm are still very impressive and the prices are very tempting and I often feel drawn to sending an order in for 
the material that is advertised so well.  But, then I note which firm placed the ad and remember my own experience and do 
not order.  However, he must have many happier customers if he is able to run expensive ads for attractive coins at prices 
less than wholesale......

Editor's Comment:  First of all, your experience is not unique at all.  At least hundreds of collectors (including 
myself) have stayed away from Paul Sims and will not order from this company again because of the egregious abuses he has 
done to us and to the coins (especially some of the rarer coins).  I don't know about the "happy customers", but I think 
the "happy customers" are probably beginners who don't know how to grade coins... :-(  Just my $.03 worth.

I remember meeting a YN who saved up $400 for a 1909-S VDB cent from Paul Sims and was deemed counterfeit and was screwed out of his money.

Re PAUL SIMS, in EVERY CASE this dealer sent me AU, harshly cleaned, MERCURY DIMES when I ordered their "BU" or "GEM BU" Mercury's.
Sigh.  I guess this is just the way business is conducted now.

Paul Sims  - Terrible, same experience as you have disclosed [above].

Once ordered a $3.00 Gold, advertised choice AU, coin was a cleaned EF+.
Returned the next day for full refund.

Comments about PrimoCoins/R.D. Decker

To say he is a bad dealer would be giving him the benefit of the doubt.  I 
ordered coins from him in July that were severly overgraded.  I sent them back for a refund 
and they just got returned by the U.S.P.S. on Saturday saying addressee unknown.   You might 
also check with [Mr. X] of [Company X] as in my conversations with [Mr. X] he stated that 
PrimoCoins (aka R.D. Decker) ripped him off on consignment coins as well.  
I have Decker's phone number but it's been disconnected.  I've already 
posted a notice on rec.collecting.coins warning folks about PrimoCoins and 
giving his name and phone number in case he comes back to life under 
another dealer name.

Hello, I have contacted our local police about him and they took a report.  
They said one of their depts would probably contact Tucson, AZ PD, but you know how that 
will go. I had contacted the apt complex where I had sent the payment but they would not 
tell me anything since I was not a law enforcement entity. RD Decker was running auctions 
in June and July. I placed a bid on one of his July auctions and was notified that I was 
the high bidder. I sent a check to him, it cleared my bank, but I have never seen anything. 
I emailed him but never got any response. There's probably no use of sticking him on your 
'bad dealer' list since he was probably not a dealer and if he ever does pop up again, he 
will be using another name and maybe a different address.

My experience with PrimoCoins is the following:  I bid on a coin in his auction 
that was to close on July 13, 1997.  I was informed on July 15, 1997 that I was high bidder 
on the coin.  I mailed payment on July 16, 1997. The Check cleared my bank on July 20, 1997 
It is now September 15, 1997, I have not recieved the coin, a refund, or any answers to 10 
emails, 5 phone messages, and two US Postal mails. I have contacted the Arizona Atty Gen 
about this company. I am sending a Registered return receipt letter today. If I get no response 
from that I will be filing the following charges in AZ 1) Theft 2) Offering goods for auction without 
possession of said items ( I have talked to his supplier, [Mr. X], and know this to be true) a 
felony in AZ. 3) Conducting an auction without a license (required in AZ for anything that can be 
considered an antique). In addition I will report him to the US post office for postal fraud.  
In my opinion R. D. Decker should be put in prison.

Comments about Publishers Clearing House

While we are on the subject of big companies ripping off the public, at the expense of future coin 
dealers who will try to "rip off" the sellers who paid way too much for their common family heirlooms, I 
thought I would mention the new coins that PCH is offering.
1804 Silver Dollar 1787 Brasher Gold Doubloon 1836 Gobrecht Dollar 1913 Liberty Head Nickel 1794 Flowing Hair Silver Dollar 1792 Disme Plus 18 other rare coins of the United States. Each coin is 2 ounces silver, UNCIRCULATED (duh!) Brilliant Proof, 24kt gold embellishment (where applicable), individually numbered. The 1804 $ can be yours for just $19.95 (+$5.95 Shipping & Handling), and then every month you can add to your "$10 Million collection" for just $39.95 (+$5.95 Shipping & Handling). WOW! What a "deal". "Delivery Insurance provided at no extra charge." (Gee! I thought that's what S&H were for, especially at $0.78 for postage and $0.75 for Insurance. $4+ for Handling?? We already know that just burns me up!) Here is a mail order site that has some numismatic offerings. Check it out.... That's right, good ol' Publisher's Clearinghouse. Here is a caapsule of what they offer: 1. 500th Anniversary Coin Collection - 4 gold-plated bronze coins in a hardwood holder. Of course we know that they are medals but what do they know? Cost: $14.95 + $3.50 s/h ($35.00 off original price). 2. Babe Ruth gold plated coin from the Liberian Mint. Didn't know that Liberia had a mint - thought they contracted somebody (Pobjoy?). Probably NCLT. $9.95 + $3.50 s/h. 3. Silver Presidential set - Kennedy half dollar and Roosevelt dime - both real silver! Plus a US stamp depicting each President. $14.95 + $3.50 s/h. I do not see that these prices are excessive except for #3. What do you think? Check out the site. Unfortunately, you must navigate all the way from homepage because of the way they have it set up. Route through merchandise and the way will be clear. Editor's Comment: Given this evidence, it seems that Publishers Clearing House is harming numismatics in some way or another. What do you think?

Comments about Ramapo Coins

I would also put RAMAPO Coins up for similar consideration.  I
once ordered 2 large cents from them that were grossly overgraded (they
were supposed to be XF and VF - the XF one was F with lots of pitting
and the VF one was a G+ with decent surfaces).  I sent these coins back
but did not get a card credit for 5 billing cycles.  I had to threaten
to take them to court and had to work with my credit card company to get
it all straightened out.  Again, I was out the shipping (about $6) but
this time I was also out all the time and costs (certified letters,
etc).  Never again.

I have done business with RAMAPO in the past.  I am a strict 
grader, and I consider the coins I bought to be almost a full grade below 
the advertised [grade] (i.e., the VF pieces were F+ at best).  However, 
the prices I paid were at least a full grade below trends, so I was not 
disappointed.  I bought several 19th century type coins, and none seemed 
to have been whizzed or abused (of course, I didn't buy coins advertised 
as AU or Unc, and those grades are the most subject to abuse).  I would 
consider doing business with RAMAPO again, except that US coin prices in 
general are too high compared to the other coins competing for my 
numismatic budget.

I stopped doing business with RAMAPO because any coin costing 
more than $10.00 was almost always overgraded.  That is why their prices 
are so good; they tend to overgrade coins.

When I was very young and just starting out, I ordered from Ramapo.  
2 bags of cents.  The only problem was they were short of the full 10,000.  
I wrote [to] them and they immediately replied with more than double the 
discrepancy, including a ROLL of UNC 39's, sold for $1 a piece in 1980.  
I cannot say how their management would react today.

RAMAPO COINS.  I ordered a 1799 Bust Dollar [in] VG from them.  When I 
received the coin I found that the grade VG to them meant VERY GRUNGY!  
It was at best a part good with a whole bunch of scratches and a BIG rim nick.  
Well, they said sorry, send it back, and they would send a replacement.  
OK, so off it goes.  I get the coin back and guess what.  IT graded a full VERY 
GOOD.  Only problem was someone had drilled a small hole in it at 3 o'clock.  
Well, this time they said it was their policy to only replace an order for a 
customer once, and they do NOT give cash refunds.  I finally sold the coin for 
300.00 less than what I paid for it, just to get some stuff going!

I got started in coin collecting buying double eagles from Ramapo.  The 
grades were accurate.  What's the complaint?  (When shopping for my 1893-S 
Morgan Dollar, I noticed their prices were a little TOO that something 
to do with it?)

Editor's Response:  Oh yeah.  Once you see a coin selling for a price that is 
too cheap, that particular dealer is probably overgrading that coin (in one way 
or another...).

My experience finally came to a close with the dealer I was mentioning.  
I guess I learned something through the whole ordeal.  The dealer was Ramapo.  The 
ad was in COINage magazine.  The coin was a 1921 Peace [Dollar].  I was told over 
the phone it would grade MS-62 to MS-63.  For $75.00, I thought this would be an 
incredible deal.  This was my first lesson learned.  Too good to be true... In my 
opinion, the coin wouldn't have graded MS anything beacuse under magnification, 
circulation was very evident.  I sent it back with a note stating this.  The company 
refunded the purchase price and the return shipping so at least I got my money back.

I just received some better date Morgan Dollars from Ramapo...they are going right 
back...they told me most customers are very happy with their grading...but the "Choice AU" 
looks XF, and the "Choice XF" coins look like VF30 at best.  Anyone else had any 
experience with this company, or am I just too picky?

My personal experience was limited to one coin:  a "BU" flying eagle cent.  The 
coin that was delivered was corroded and harshly cleaned AU.  It went back very fast.  
'Nuff said.

I got burned by Ramapo a few years back by buying an 1895-O Morgan supposedly 
in BU for $975.  Needless to say, I got instead a cleaned AU.  I returned it and got a refund 
but I should've known there's no such thing as a bargain in this hobby.

Anyone who buys from RAMAPO more than once really needs some education on grading.  
In fact they are the only firm that never followed up on one of my orders with a mailing list 
(even though I was too much of a neophyte to return anything).  They must just assume that you 
will know that you've been taken and will never order again.

On July 13, 1997, I received part of an order that I placed with Ramapo.  The 
entire order was for four CC Morgans and a 1/2 bag of Wheat Cents.  I received the Morgans, all 
graded VF? by Ramapo.  However, the bag of wheat cents was not included.  I called their customer 
service and they said it was their mistake and would send the rest of the order right out.  Almost 
two weeks have passed and I have received nothing.  I guess that is the last time I do business with 
them.  I have also warned friends who collect coins to avoid Ramapo.

Re RAMAPO, in EVERY CASE this dealer sent me AU, harshly cleaned, MERCURY DIMES when I ordered their "BU" or "GEM BU" Mercury's.  Sigh.  I guess this is just the way business is conducted now.

I saw your (referring to Ramapo) ad in CoinAge and ordered several coins from you (again, referring to Ramapo).
I asked that you ship it fastest way as I was leaving on vacation and wanted the coins before I left.  The coins 
arrived on 6/23/98, 12 days later.
While I am new to the hobby, I use the Official Red Book of US Coins by Whitman for grading.
What I ordered and what I received were vastly different.
Denomination Ordered Received Grade Discrepancy
Large Cent Coronet VF F 1
Copper Nickel Cent XF F 2
Indian Head Cent BU BU 0
1909 VDB Cent BU UNC[Not Brilliant] 1
3 Cent Silver Type 1 XF VF 1
Liberty Nickel XF VF 1
Buffalo Nickel-Type 1 AU VG[1Barely readable] 3
1938-D Buffalo BU BU 0
Seated Half Dime Stars XF F 2
Seated Half Dime Arrows VF F 1
Seated Half Dime XF VF 1
Seated Dime Arrows VF F 1
Seated Dime Legend XF VF 1
I am very disappointed with your grading of coins. As such, coins that I thought were good deals are actually over priced. I know you say I can return for credit less shipping. I am now leaving on extended trip and won't be home for several months and choose not to take on the hassle. I guess the lesson cost me $157.00.

Comments about Alan Sass

I paid for a coin from Alan Sass in early July 1997 and have yet to receive 
the coin.  Had heard bad about him from others but thought I would try an inexpensive 
purchase from him.  Should have just thrown the money in the Mississippi!!

Comments about Skyline Coin

Skyline Coin of Front Royal, Virginia advertised 25 different 
date BU Silver Washington Quarter sets to include a couple of "free" 
proof quarters.  The invoice included the "free" coins, but they were not 
in the undamaged package shipped from Skyline.  Upon examination, at 
least half of the coins were cleaned.  Upon return, the package was 
damaged in the mail and Skyline was very helpful with filing the 
insurance claim.  However, they told me that they would not give me the 
"free" coins until the claim was settled.  I tried to help them 
understand that they had their money and I was out my money and the coins 
until the post office paid the claim.  Anyway, once the claim was settled 
I sent them documentation of payment of the claim and asked for the 
"free" coins.  They did not respond.  I sent another request about a 
month ago and indicated that I would begin telling this story to the 
world if they didn't ship those coins.  Well they have my money, they 
never shipped the product as advertised, and I was reimbursed by the post 
office for the purchase price of the coins but not for shipping 
expenses.  So I'm out two-way shipping and insurance and Skyline made its 
money without shipping a complete order.  Fraud?

Editor's Comment:  I was about to purchase a test order from Skyline 
until you made this contributing comment.  I thank you very much and I am 
warning every potential collector/numismatist to watch for these 
unscrupulous/rogue dealers trying to defraud collectors/numismatists out 
of their hard-earned money.

Well, I couldn't resist buying an 1886-O this time from another dealer 
(Skyline Coins) which also was a "Very Select Brilliant Uncirculated".  Cost:  $139.  
As soon as I opened up the cardboard, voila, a friggin' shiny (but no cartwheel 
luster!) coin with telltale faded locks of hair over Liberty's ear and feathers worn 
down on the reverse.  Returned it the next morning.

I ordered some coins from Skyline recently.  Two of the "S" coins would only 
grade out to AU50/52 from my grading standards.  They were the only coins I 
received in that shipment without mint luster.  I wrote Skyline a terse letter, 
but I'm still waiting for an answer.

Comments about Southern Coin Investments

Re Southern Coin Investments, in EVERY CASE this dealer sent me AU, harshly cleaned,
MERCURY DIMES when I ordered their "BU" or "GEM BU" Mercury's.
Sigh.  I guess this is just the way business is conducted now.

To make a comment about a dealer on this list, please e-mail me and tell me who the dealer is and tell me if you had any satisfactory/unsatisfactory dealings with the particular dealer. I will post your comments, without any identifying information (that is, your name and e-mail will not be displayed on this page.)

Back to the Bad Dealers Page

Back to the Numismatic Death Penalty Page

This e-mail address printed below is for personal use only and is not to be used for commercial use, "spam", and the like.
Any commercial use of this e-mail address without my expressed and explicit e-mailed permission is strictly prohibited!